how important is speed??.....really

i keep reading treads about who's the fastest and about members who play fast. i just want to know from these people... just how do they view speed in playing and songwriting. is this really what makes a guitarist stand out or is speed really that important??

Speed is only important if that is what you think.
I personally could give less about being fast, I just play what I like. I don't hate fast playing with a passion like lots of guitarists seem to do though, it can be pretty fun.

i think that speed has nothing to do with songwriting, and in most cases i think it can sound a little out of place. i personally think that playing fast is a way to show talent. it doesn't neccesarily make one person better than another, but if millions of people can all write amazing songs, but one of those millions figures out a way to also play faster than any of the others, than who do you think will be held in higher regaurd. it is no different thatn people trying to write better songs than each other... it's simply a tool to be used to standout from the croud.

Depends on what you play.
In neoclassical shredding, you can say that
speed is important.
In jazz, nope.

i didn't mean that i don't like playing fast i love it. in fact, i just made a new trick called 53 notes per second. as the veraciously original title implies i play the lick at 53 notes a second. i've heard that the fastest was 42 by the guitarist from MR. Cucuber, so i would like to know if it is an official record, and if so, how i can go about trying to break it. anyway, check out my sound file in my trick and see what you think

So you can play 53 notes per second?
Do you even realize how fast that is?
Im afraid its impossible for the human hand to
play that fast.
I think the world record is 26.
Im not accusing you or anything, but if you
speeded it up in a program like goldwave,
its going to be hard to play it for the
Guinness judges.

[Edited by mc9mm on 07-17-2002 at 04:39 PM]

i know your not trying to offend me, but i definitely did not speed it up. did you listen to it? does it sound like 26 notes per second, becuase i'm definitely playing it as fast as you hear it, so however fast it sounds to you is as fast as it is.

i think you will better understand how it is possible if you read my post in the thread "another quesion to shredders" i explicitly describe how i do it. i hope that will help

in the 40 yard dash, it's quite important.

its actually your post in "another question to shredders" that made me put up this thread. i really want to hear your achievement. congratulations for stretching the bounderies of the guitar. its still nice to see though that there are a lot of guitar players who only use speed if they have to. i have a huge respect for guitarists like steve morse and steve vai who only use speed to convey the emotions of the song. we know they can speed it up like the rest (hey steve vai even replaced malmsteen in alcatrazz) but still gave more priority to songwriting than showing off. and lalimacefolle, dude its always fun to read your replies.

I was just curious as to how long you've been playing, I myself have been seriously playing for 11-12 years now, and although I'm not as fast as I was (when I would religiously play for every spare hour of the day) a few years ago, back then, at full speed, I could perhaps, on a good day, manage 18-20 notes per second, I was extremely impressed with your trick tho, and if you've not been playing as long as me, I swear I'll sulk!

[Edited by nasum_human on 07-18-2002 at 01:40 PM]

i've been playing for three years, and thank you kristian.

and i too enjoy reading lami's posts

Me too, I love reading myself.

Yeah, K
I think speed is fine as long as its only used tastefully. If all you do is shred then it gets a bit tiresome.
And to 53 nps, I certainly dont meen to sound insulting here, but when I listened to your sound file of you playing that fast, I honestly couldn't hear the different notes. It was like one big jumble of sound. Whats the point of going that fast? 20 notes per second mabey, but I would only go 53 nps to impress people and stuff.

just me, again, I would say that it's hard to differentiate the notes, but at a frequency of 53hz, the human ear is gonna have a hard time, with a little messing about on my computer (half the hassle was converting the mp3 into a WAV file so my editing software would accept it) I think that you're definetely onto something, although at this speed, the note clarity is hardly going to be great, I'd reccomend that you put a couple of compression effects in there so you get a REALLY tight focused sound, because with any hint of distortion it blurs the notes together, I can hear clearly that you're playing many many notes, but I wasnt too sure about 53, at this speed, human error gets in the way (plus, I'm a little jealous that you can play over TWICE as fast as me, and I thought I was damn sharp hehe)
I think we need someone to use a sampler and slow the hell out of it to listen, good luck though and I wasnt trying to cut you down, just offering some constructive criticism!

to reply to josh... i definitely agree with what you are saying, and to be honest...in most songs i play i don't play that fast. usually i play around 25 notes stacatto and around 30 notes legato, but even then i try to use it tastefully, making an effort only to play fast once or twice a solo, just as a tool. but, since i play a type of fusiony rock, speed can be used to help along the music. while it doesn't really matter in fusion, many good fusion guitarists like shawn lane or John McLaughlin play very fast (in fact, it was a combonation of their two picking styles that caused me to come up with my "rolling" technique)
and yes, the main reason i play this fast is to impress people. I'm only 16 years old, so it would be a good way to get my foot in the door and make a name for myself if i could use my rolling technique as a gimmick. if i can play faster than anyone twice my age, than maybe people will at least give me a chance. so after i perfect the technique, i want to record a demo tape, using my speed as a tool to catch ones attention, and then letting my songs speak for themselves.

and to nas - i didn't take offense to your questions just so you know, and i appreciate you taking the time to try and figure out the actual speed. but i do think that it will never be possible to slow it down enough to count the notes, because the basis of the technique is that one note starts before the next ends.

That's the problem you would encounter, the judges from guinness would definetely want to be able to hear the individual notes, therefore the fact that they do blur into one may not constitute 'seperate' notes, I have no idea, just throwing that idea into the pot.
Perhaps playing the piece on a double speed guitar might help with note clarity, although I see what you're doing and I'm tempted to try it myself, just purely for recreational purposes, personally I dont really hear much difference from 15 notes per second onwards, and it is simply an expression of pure skill.
Another thing about why your trick could be counted as 'not legal' is that it would be possible to use a wah pedal or similar to change the pitch of the notes, this would be quite a similar effect to the 'rolling' of the fingers you describe
just pushing some ideas around about it, I actually want it to be right and correct, I could say 'I spoke to the record holder of that' and show off

hey, it's me. formally 53nps. this is my new name and i wil be posting my trick under this new name. i will use a new lick and a new sound file, so check it out.

and i did think of the clarity problem discounting the technique for guiness, so i'm going to try and find a way to make it possible to hear all the notes. maybe a lot of noise gate and compression, and a very clean sound, will do it.

Just a question to Furryz. Your not much older than I am and have been playing a year longer, and you play twice over twice as fast as I do. How long did it take you to reach that speed, and when did you start trying to reach that speed? Just curious, as playing a little faster would be nice.

i was always good at playing fast. i dunno, i guess i just have a lot of natural dexterity. my dad was always a very fast guitarist so when i started playing i wanted to play fast too. after about a year and a half i could play just about as fast as anybody i was hearing at the time. it wasn't until i heard guys like shawn lane around 6 months ago that i tried to play any faster.
i never spent time on my style or on getting a good sound. i just skipped right to speed. it wasn't until the last year that i started ignoring speed and playing basic blues and stuff. i just now am getting confident in my style. i know i have the technical ability, so i just let that come by itself. i guess that is what makes my style unique. i can interject technical prowess into just about any style and make it fit. but at the same time i can also play with a lot of emotion.