So I have this song I'm making...

It's in the key of C. I wanted to layer the melody that I made. I don't know what the terms would be to describe this so bear with me. Is there a way for me to use the same major pattern but in a different key that sounds more bassy, but would compliment the higher pitched major c scale i'm using? So I guess that would be something that's on the "perfect opposite" side of the spectrum (if there is such a thing). Or do I need to go back down the neck and find the same notes in the melody just in a lower octave than the first? Maybe both are possible I don't know.

Originally Posted by: icebreaker1588I wanted to layer the melody that I made.[/quote]
You have 2 basic options here.

1. Harmonize the existing melody.
2. Create a secondary, counter melody that compliments the primary melodic line.

Or you can create a composite of both options.

Originally Posted by: icebreaker1588Is there a way for me to use the same major pattern but in a different key that sounds more bassy, but would compliment the higher pitched major c scale i'm using?

Using the same major scale (in any pattern) means to use the same key. And typically this is precisely what you want to do: keep all the material happening at the same time in the same key.

And the term to describe this is harmony. :) You want to harmonize the melody in a lower register.
[QUOTE=icebreaker1588]Or do I need to go back down the neck and find the same notes in the melody just in a lower octave than the first?

Yes, that's one way to do it. Playing exactly the same note letters, or a better way to think of it is, playing the same scale degrees an octave lower is called doubling the melody at a harmony of an octave below.

Or you can use triadic harmony to play different scale degrees, but from the same scale to create an interesting harmony.

I cover creating harmony guitar parts in these tutorials.

https://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial.php?input=1965
https://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial.php?input=2000
https://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial.php?input=2014

And for a more complete conceptual understanding of how harmony works have a look at my tutorial on the basics of music theory. Harmony, and specifically triadic harmony, forms the basis of how we build scales into chords, chord progressions and harmonize melodies in music.

https://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial.php?input=495

Hope this helps. Please ask more if necessary. Best of success!

yes! so excited to learn how this works! Thanks so much for replying!!!!!

Interesting take on the use of the pickup. Never would have thought of that. That would be an excellent choice if you're looking to harmonize but not have a drastic change. You'll get a mild tweak on fullness (depending on your pickups) compared to the very full sound you get when using the octave method. Comparatively i used a different octave plus the other pickup to see how that would feel too.

Alright so now i'm a bit confused though. You're talking about a melody being a 3rd or 6th higher. How do I know which octaves are X higher/lower than the other one? When I harmonized my melody I just chose a spot where it would be easy to play.

Originally Posted by: icebreaker1588yes! so excited to learn how this works! Thanks so much for replying!!!!!
[/quote]
You're welcome! It's fun stuff. :)
[QUOTE=icebreaker1588]
Alright so now i'm a bit confused though. You're talking about a melody being a 3rd or 6th higher. How do I know which octaves are X higher/lower than the other one? When I harmonized my melody I just chose a spot where it would be easy to play.

An octave is a specific interval of an 8th. To play a harmony of an octave means to double the melody 8 scale degrees higher or lower than the original notes of the melody. Harmonizing at an interval of a 3rd means to double the melody 3 scale degrees higher or lower. All harmonies are done at some specific interval distance. I cover this in great depth with lots of examples in the tutorials.

Let's use this simple melody in C major as an example.

|--------------------------------------------|
|------5-------------------------------------|
|-5-7----7-5---------------------------------|
|--------------------------------------------|
|--------------------------------------------|
|--------------------------------------------|

3 notes: C-D-E-D-C. Very simple little phrase. Think of them as scale degrees in C major.

E ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
B ||---|---|---|---|-3-|---|---|---|---|
G ||---|---|---|---|-1-|---|-2-|---|---|
D ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
A ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
E ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|

C - 1
D - 2
E - 3

So, in scale degrees, our phrase is 1-2-3-2-1.

Let's harmonize it one octave below. That means the same scale degrees, but down 1 octave. This is also an interval of an 8th below.

|--------------------------------------------|
|------5-------------------------------------|
|-5-7----7-5---------------------------------|
|------2-------------------------------------|
|-3-5----5-3---------------------------------|
|--------------------------------------------|

Melody:
C - 1
D - 2
E - 3

Harmony:
(all one octave lower)
C - 1
D - 2
E - 3

Now let's harmonize it a 3rd above.

|-------3------------------------------------|
|-5-6--5-6-5---------------------------------|
|-5-7----7-5---------------------------------|
|--------------------------------------------|
|--------------------------------------------|
|--------------------------------------------|

Melody:
C - 1
D - 2
E - 3

Harmony:
(all a 3rd higher)
E - 3
F - 4
G - 5

So our melody is still 1-2-3-2-1.
But our harmony is 3-4-5-4-3.

In order to find our harmony interval distance of a 3rd we counted 3 scale degrees up from C to E & so forth to find the harmony for each note of the melody.

C to E (1-2-3)
D to F (2-3-4)
E to G (3-4-5)

Make sense?

We create a harmony of a 3rd higher by playing another note from the same scale an interval of a 3rd higher on that scale.

Let's try a 3rd lower

|--------------------------------------------|
|------5-------------------------------------|
|-5-7-5--7-5---------------------------------|
|-7-8----8-7---------------------------------|
|--------------------------------------------|
|--------------------------------------------|

Melody:
C - 1
D - 2
E - 3

Harmony:
(3rd lower)
A - 6
B - 7
C - 1

3rds & octaves are basic way to harmonize & the intervals most commonly used. But you can use any interval. Exploring possible harmonies is fun! :)

I don't know why I didn't get this when i watched the video... maybe i learn better reading haha

So I didn't do it how you described. This is what I did to get the effect I wanted.


|--------------------------------------------|
|--------------------------------------------|
|--10--9-------------10--9-----------------|
|---------10--9--7-----------10--9--12----|
|--------------------------------------------|
|--------------------------------------------|



|-----------------12----------------------------|
|-------------13------13/15--13--12-----------|
|--------14-----------------------------14--12-|
|---12------------------------------------------|
|------------------------------------------------|
|------------------------------------------------|


|--------------------------------------------|
|--------------------------------------------|
|--9--10--9--12--10--9--------------------|
|--------------------------10---------------|
|--------------------------------------------|
|--------------------------------------------|

Scale Degrees:
4 3 1 7 6
4 3 1 7 2 etc...

I went over to the 3rd fret on the D string where you have a very similar pattern and played the exact same scale degrees in order, but it sounds a lot darker.

Originally Posted by: icebreaker1588This is what I did to get the effect I wanted.


|--------------------------------------------|
|--------------------------------------------|
|--10--9-------------10--9-----------------|
|---------10--9--7-----------10--9--12----|
|--------------------------------------------|
|--------------------------------------------|



|-----------------12----------------------------|
|-------------13------13/15--13--12-----------|
|--------14-----------------------------14--12-|
|---12------------------------------------------|
|------------------------------------------------|
|------------------------------------------------|


|--------------------------------------------|
|--------------------------------------------|
|--9--10--9--12--10--9--------------------|
|--------------------------10---------------|
|--------------------------------------------|
|--------------------------------------------|

Scale Degrees:
4 3 1 7 6
4 3 1 7 2 etc...
[/quote]
So this line is your melody.
[QUOTE=icebreaker1588]
I went over to the 3rd fret on the D string where you have a very similar pattern and played the exact same scale degrees in order, but it sounds a lot darker.

And you doubled that whole line an octave lower.

I'm glad you figured out something you like! Good job. :)

Originally Posted by: ChristopherSchlegel

3rds & octaves are basic way to harmonize & the intervals most commonly used. But you can use any interval. Exploring possible harmonies is fun! :)

Is there a way to measure the octave as being a certain distance from your original melody? Or is it always referred to as being an octave lower or higher than the melody?

Originally Posted by: icebreaker1588Is there a way to measure the octave as being a certain distance from your original melody?[/quote]
An octave is always the specific interval of an 8th. To play a harmony of an octave means to double the melody 8 scale degrees higher or lower than the original notes of the melody.

For example, if you are in the key of C major, you start on the note C, you want to play an octave lower, then you'd count 8 scales down the scale from your starting note.

Starting note C.

E ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
B ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
G ||---|---|---|---|-c-|---|---|---|---|
D ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
A ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
E ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|

Count down an octave.

c-b-a-g-f-e-d-c
1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8

These C's are an octave apart. The lower one is an octave lower than the starting one.

E ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
B ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
G ||---|---|---|---|-c-|---|---|---|---|
D ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
A ||---|---|-c-|---|---|---|---|---|---|
E ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|

Or if you want to go up an octave, then count 8 scale degrees up.

c-d-e-f-g-a-b-c
1-2-3-4-5-6-7-8

E ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|-c-|---|
B ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
G ||---|---|---|---|-c-|---|---|---|---|
D ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
A ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
E ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|

As opposed to an interval of a 3rd. Here's a 3rd lower than C, which is an A. To get from C to A you count 3 scale degrees down.

c-b-a
1-2-3

E ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
B ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
G ||---|-a-|---|---|-c-|---|---|---|---|
D ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
A ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
E ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|

To harmonize a 3rd higher than C, count 3 scale degrees up from C to E.

c-d-e
1-2-3

E ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
B ||---|---|---|---|-e-|---|---|---|---|
G ||---|---|---|---|-c-|---|---|---|---|
D ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
A ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
E ||---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|

[QUOTE=icebreaker1588] Or is it always referred to as being an octave lower or higher than the melody?

I'm not entirely sure what you are asking here. A harmony note can be any interval higher or lower than the original starting melody note. An octave is simply one possible interval to use. But the harmony note can be a 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, 7th, or 8th (octave) or any chromatic interval in between those.

Does that make sense?

there's something I'm not getting. it will click eventually

Originally Posted by: icebreaker1588there's something I'm not getting. it will click eventually

I encourage you to work through GF2 starting with my tutorials on the basics of intervals & scales.

https://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial.php?input=362
https://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial.php?input=363

It seems like you might not be grasping these interconnected issues.

1. The distance between any two notes is called the interval.
2. And the interval can be any distance.
3. The interval (or distance between any two notes) can be a scale degree of a 2nd or a 3rd, etc.
4. The octave is just one of many possible interval. The octave is a scale degree of an 8th.
5. When you play two different notes together that is a harmony. Or when they sound together in a piece of music.
6. The interval distance between the two notes you play together is called "a harmony of that specific interval".

Maybe that helps?! :)

Boom! got it thank you!

Originally Posted by: ChristopherSchlegelI encourage you to work through GF2 starting with my tutorials on the basics of intervals & scales.

https://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial.php?input=362
https://www.guitartricks.com/tutorial.php?input=363

It seems like you might not be grasping these interconnected issues.

1. The distance between any two notes is called the interval.
2. And the interval can be any distance.
3. The interval (or distance between any two notes) can be a scale degree of a 2nd or a 3rd, etc.
4. The octave is just one of many possible interval. The octave is a scale degree of an 8th.
5. When you play two different notes together that is a harmony. Or when they sound together in a piece of music.
6. The interval distance between the two notes you play together is called "a harmony of that specific interval".

Maybe that helps?! :)

Originally Posted by: icebreaker1588Boom! got it thank you!

Good deal! :)