What's your problem?


Joseph
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Joseph
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01/02/2002 4:24 pm


As musicians, it's safe to say that we all strive for perfection, I guess it's in our blood. However, we all have our faults. Over the past several years, I've written many different songs, but I also have many unfinished songs. Sometimes when I'm on a roll I try too hard to finish up, where I find myself forcing creativity.

Overall, the best songs that we write come naturally, within each breath. It's a gift...and I think when we force ourselves too hard to finish a thought, we are merely ruining the creative process. As musicians, I think we all strive to make an honest representation of of thoughts, but if we don't learn to slow down, then we'll end up defeating ourselves, and fooling others as well.

So, I have faults, I have to learn to pace myself in order to see the best results from my personal compositions. I know my faults, what's yours?

-Joseph

www.ragmagazine.com
"Swoop and soar like the blues angels."
# 1
zepp_rules
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zepp_rules
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01/02/2002 5:36 pm
i always want to do things now, and when i can't do them i fet really frustrated.
To improve technique and of course trying to keep all as clean as possible. I know my own limits and speed limits and so on I never play anything I'm not capable of. That wouldn't make any sense. After three years of playing I tried to play everything as fast as possible and that sounded, I would say, like shit, and I didn't realize that if I'd play bit slower things than I was capable of playing then everything would sound much better.

--Aleksi Laiho - Advice to Play By
# 2
Lordathestrings
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Lordathestrings
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01/02/2002 9:09 pm
My imagination always seems to outpace my technical ability. The more I develop my skills, the more possibilities I become aware of, and I'm continually trying to 'catch up' to myself. What makes it frustrating, is that I don't have 5 hours a day to engage in such activities.
Lordathestrings
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# 3
PlayLikeDavid
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PlayLikeDavid
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01/02/2002 9:21 pm
When I play, I play what I feel from my soul and it follows through to my fingers. The emotion can be felt in the music. What drives me crazy is people who try to "bottle" someone else's creativity. Allow me to explain this briefly.

I was just in a band at church. After I had been there 3-4 years, the church brought in a new music minister . Up until this time, the music services were great. The styles were varied and everyone got what they came for whether it was a little blues/rock, slow or medium tempo or even a little C&W style picking (after all, you have to please everyone in that venue, ya know).

Anyway, the new minister is about 12 years younger than myself and has been to music school. He is very well learned and talented on the sax. Here is where my problem lies. Being as he is so school taught and theory oriented, he began to tell all the musicians how to play, what to play, when to play and how it should be played. Thus went to the extreme that he began deciding what equipment should be used, what pedal should be turned on...etc. I know the importance of working as a team and making everything "fit" is vital to musical success.

Maybe I am being really stupid here, but this is how I feel. I have invested a lot of money in my rig so that I am able to express myself musically. My artistic license/expression was ripped from me and can never be returned. I have left that situation and do not think I will be going back to it any time soon.

So I guess my problem is that I want to play my instrument my way. Aside from nominal changes that fit a riff/passage into a song or whatever, I feel that I am enough of a musician to be trusted to not overplay and overpower. I do not need a babysitter or a guidance cousellor.
Let's have a knock down drag out rock'n'roll party in the street!
Chuck
# 4
Lordathestrings
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Lordathestrings
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01/02/2002 9:39 pm
Being true to your own vision might seem like a selfish approach, but in doing so, you established a sucessful working relatonship with your peers and the congregaton.

This new minister seems to be determined to impose his own will on all involved. I suggest this is a far more selfich approach to the situation.

I'm not a religious man, but I understand the importance of setting ego aside in favour of the music. Perhaps this fellow should have learned a bit of humility along with the theory.
Lordathestrings
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# 5
Raskolnikov
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Raskolnikov
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01/03/2002 1:19 am
PlayLikeDavid: Find a video of Dana Colley from Morphine wailing away on two saxes at once and show it to this guy. Or Skerrack (most recently in Col. Les Claypool's Fearless Flying Frog Brigade) playing with feedback and such in the middle of sax solos.

Of course, that would probably help nothing.


As for me, I tend to overplay, and I need to work on my sense of time.
Raskolnikov
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# 6
Incidents Happen
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Incidents Happen
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01/03/2002 1:29 am
my fault is that i know i can be better than how i am, but i dont realize it takes years to become a great one. well i realize that but my brain doesnt. or somethih like that. But i had a dream about it yesterday night and i think if i had several jam sessions with some other guitar player, i think after a few times i'd get used to his playin, same with him, and we'd get pretty good at jamming.

joseph when i started playing i couldnt get my chords down or anything, that was when i pressured myself, etc. when i said "eh, if i get it cool if not oh well" that SAME hour i got it right. and i skipped down the street singing.

so how does that connect to you? maybe your faults have to do with the pressure you put on yourself. Just a suggestion

[Edited by Incidents Happen on 01-02-2002 at 08:33 PM]
# 7
Psycho Amram
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Psycho Amram
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01/03/2002 7:49 am
i alway think how a good solo or piece of music should be heard but when i try to play it i always play it otherwise and start fooling around it and never get to play it right and then forget all about it
it happens to me most when i hear a good song and try to write down it's tab

and about song writing i have an unfinished song for quite some time so far i have the very start and the very midle how will they connect? how will it end? will it end? i dont know and i dont care. if it works it works.
once my friend and i had to finish a song quickly so we forced creativity and so far it's our most successful recorded song...
God sent meat,
and the Devil sent cooks.

Excuse me while i keep this eye
# 8
PlayLikeDavid
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PlayLikeDavid
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01/05/2002 2:25 pm
Originally posted by Lordathestrings
Being true to your own vision might seem like a selfish approach, but in doing so, you established a sucessful working relatonship with your peers and the congregaton.

This new minister seems to be determined to impose his own will on all involved. I suggest this is a far more selfich approach to the situation.

I'm not a religious man, but I understand the importance of setting ego aside in favour of the music. Perhaps this fellow should have learned a bit of humility along with the theory.


Thank you for your response. I never thought of this in terms of "being true to my vision", but that makes a whole lot of sense to me now.
Also, understand that I have been trained in church to come under the authority of those in leadership. This stems from the belief that God places people in leadership positions for reasons only he (God) understands. I accept that on it's premise and do not question God's will in any way. But I do think that a person can go to an extreme and really mess it up.
Case in point: Adam & Eve in the Garden of Eden. They were placed there for a reason and later on really messed it up by leaving the protection of God's will and seeking their own gratification.
I hope that made sense.
This will be my last post on this subject here. I am getting off of the forum's focus now. If you want to continue this, email me privately at PlayLikeDavid@AOL.com
Let's have a knock down drag out rock'n'roll party in the street!
Chuck
# 9
PlayLikeDavid
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PlayLikeDavid
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01/05/2002 2:37 pm
Originally posted by Raskolnikov
PlayLikeDavid: Find a video of Dana Colley from Morphine wailing away on two saxes at once and show it to this guy. Or Skerrack (most recently in Col. Les Claypool's Fearless Flying Frog Brigade) playing with feedback and such in the middle of sax solos.

Of course, that would probably help nothing.


As for me, I tend to overplay, and I need to work on my sense of time.


You're right. It probably would not resolve anything. I am not saying that Pastor X isn't talented. He most certainly is. What I am saying, and I will say it plainly here, is that he is a control freak. For some reason, he needs to control every aspect of his surrounding atmosphere. I don't know why, but that is where I think he is coming from and I will not be controlled to that extent. Musicians have and need a certain measure of freedom to practise their art. He denies that to those around him and that is dead wrong.
This will be my last post on this subject here. We're getting off of the focus of this forum which is guitars and music. Thank you for caring enough to post on this.

Now on to your timing trouble. Have you worked with a metronome? That is a great way to master your timing. Start slow and build upward. This will help your timing and speed at the same time. Good luck.
Let's have a knock down drag out rock'n'roll party in the street!
Chuck
# 10
Weakicks
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Weakicks
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01/06/2002 3:09 am
Originally posted by Joseph


As musicians, it's safe to say that we all strive for perfection, I guess it's in our blood. However, we all have our faults. Over the past several years, I've written many different songs, but I also have many unfinished songs. Sometimes when I'm on a roll I try too hard to finish up, where I find myself forcing creativity.

Overall, the best songs that we write come naturally, within each breath. It's a gift...and I think when we force ourselves too hard to finish a thought, we are merely ruining the creative process. As musicians, I think we all strive to make an honest representation of of thoughts, but if we don't learn to slow down, then we'll end up defeating ourselves, and fooling others as well.

So, I have faults, I have to learn to pace myself in order to see the best results from my personal compositions. I know my faults, what's yours?

-Joseph
Hey !! You remind me allittle of myself the way you say that.Do you study jazz at all??Jazz drummers and all that kind of music really helps me sometimes.It's cool to improvise with a good drummer and have them use mallets and brushes and really focuse on tonalitys and dimensions.
# 11


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01/07/2002 12:41 am
I forgot the basics when I started. Went right away to lead guitar. Now I find myself struggling with basic stuff.

At first, everybody a knew was playing guitar. So I picked up one and started to play. It was a stupid race to be the best player. What a mistake, what a waste of energy. I would of cover much more theory and gain skill much faster if I just took the time to understand what I played. But you know what, I about the only one who still play that guitar.

I think my biggest problem now is that I'm impatient. I can play fast licks but I get frustrated when my chords sounds wierd. I never took time to master them and now I don't want to take the time. I want to play now and perfectly. I'm working on it but it's a long, long road.
# 12
PlayLikeDavid
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PlayLikeDavid
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01/07/2002 6:47 pm
Originally posted by PonyOne
My old guitarist had this issue where he had been the front man of his old band. He joined the outfit that I and my bassist had started and at first accepted his new role: I was the frontman, and though I did'nt have anything against him doing backing vocals and even having a couple songs where he sung and he did the solos, it never seemed enough.

It came to a head at a practice where he would continually turn his amp higher and higher till low and behold, where'd my SG go?

He was also always complaining that I rarely used chords so much as just one string, or doing something like playing the A and D strings in unison, at the same fret, then moving a finger two frets lower over the D string and then adding another finger to the mix, blah blah blah. I guess that's my fault, I'm not as interested in chords and structures as I should be... but hey, I get the job done, and singing, soloing, and operating a synth via footswitch all at the same time is plenty to worry about...

He eventually left and went to play with a "REAL" musician who went to Berklee (ooh) and a few other whikids that had been honing their craft since they were like 5. And he hated it. It was always "I don't care if it feels right, the way that the scale is structured you can't do it!" and stuff of that nature. So he quit them. Now we're back together as a team, minus the bassist who has left for other pursuits, and are going to try things out again.

David, I used to be in a Christian following, and for a long time went under the "God places people over me for a reason" mentality, but, without getting into a massive philosphical debate, also remember that God blessed us with free will, and as such even if God's master plan is at work, humans can break from that and form their own opinions (can you tell I'm Jewish now?). I believe that eventually it all comes around, but there are many paths along that road.

Perhaps this is to teach you or someone else a valuable lesson, perhaps it's just that this guy is a jerk and he happened to end up in this position, who knows. The bottom line is that you and the other musicians were not being treated fairly, and you should inform him of that.
I don't mean you should barge in and be like "Look jerk, you're being a jerk" but perhaps you should sit down with him and a couple other like-minded bandmates and just be like "look, we don't want to offend you, and we understand that you are the new music director, but we just don't feel like you are taking into account that we are musicians."
God gave you a gift and this guy doesn't have any right to try and stifle it.


I know I said I wouldn't post again, but this one deserves an answer. You have hit it right on the head,Pony.
This minister was music director at his previous church, where his dad was senior Pastor (I wonder how he got that job, huh?). He also has a couple of CD's that he made with that band/choir. I bought both CD's about a month before I left. When I listened to them, I realized that although a full band and choir were credited on the jacket, they could not be heard at all in the recording. I decided then that I did not want to be a part of somebody else's "glory train".
My real problem is that I know I belong in a Christian band/group. When I play worship music, whether a chorus or whatever, that is how I commune with God. Prayer works great, but music is my true prayer language. I have seen people healed, delivered and even receive salvation because the music touched them on that level. I don't understand why a minister of God can't see that when a theologically untrained person like me can.
The part about sitting down with him and talking things out is a really good idea. I have tried to do that on my own to no avail. I also spoke to a couple of band members. They agreed with me, but are afraid to say anything to him because of his position. Our Senior pastor backs up his staff (musicians are not paid staff members) no matter what the situation, so going to him is out of the question as well
Oh, by the way, it doesn't matter if you're Jewish or Protestant or Catholic or whatever. We're all in the same mix together. Actually, the Jesus Christ that I follow is a Jewish carpenter.
So are you a Messianic Jew or an Orthodox Jew?
Once again, I go off the deep end and leave the focus of the forum. Thanks for caring enough to post.

[Edited by PlayLikeDavid on 01-07-2002 at 01:55 PM]
Let's have a knock down drag out rock'n'roll party in the street!
Chuck
# 13
Joseph
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Joseph
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01/09/2002 1:06 am
Originally posted by Weakicks
Hey !! You remind me allittle of myself the way you say that.Do you study jazz at all??Jazz drummers and all that kind of music really helps me sometimes.It's cool to improvise with a good drummer and have them use mallets and brushes and really focuse on tonalitys and dimensions. [/B][/QUOTE]

I dabble in a little bit of everything, but yes I would have to say that jazz music really does play a big roll in my technique. For hours I sometimes tend to sit back and relax (that is whenever I can,) listening to music of all different kinds. And I search fo certain elements that can inspire me in more ways than one.

It's very difficult to find willing musicians down here in South Florida, those who ar willing to put in the time and effort that's needed. I swear I would love to rent a recording studio for the day, and simply record the drums, guitar, bass, and vocals all by myself. I'm sure it would be an amazing exerience, which also builds a great level of independence. But money is a little scarce, maybe in a few weeks.

-Joseph
www.ragmagazine.com
"Swoop and soar like the blues angels."
# 14
Parrot Head 1970
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Parrot Head 1970
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01/13/2002 5:47 am
Not that I'm knocking many of the newer bands, but I can't find a new act whose guitarist gives me something to feed off of. There's no inspiration there. Admitted!!!! I'm older but I was never stuck with Clapton and the Dominoes! I like Satch. I appreciated Vai. Ed gave me years of things to accomplish. But I feel like the "New Ramones Era" has really nothing to offer other than three note melody lines and three note songs. I'm not into feedback for a living. Many of the new acts have some very intelligent songs and some very hooky lines but, little substance.
If anyone out there has an outlet I can plug into for some new ideas i'd appreciate it.
Until then me and Satch, Vai, Zappa and Ed will just jam away.

All the best!!!!!! :cool:
# 15


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01/13/2002 5:24 pm
If your into a challenge try out Dream Theater on for size.

The music is heavier than Clapton but John Petrucci is a master of his style.

I got a live show they made in japan on Video and Petrucci breaks into a amazing solo. Going from fast paced Yngwie style to some fingerpicking jazz licks. I had to rewind the tape a 20 times, that's what I like about him. He really is a versatile guitarist. Well, all the members of the band are amazing.
# 16
lalimacefolle
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lalimacefolle
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01/13/2002 5:39 pm
John PETRUCCI said (Guitar world september 2001) "I actually listen to Ron THAL, what he does blows me away"
Ummmmmmmmmmm... Would you like to check him out?
Here's one of his licked I have posted:
http://www.guitartricks.com/2000/trick.php?trick_id=3659
Get why petrucci likes it?
and also there are his sites http://www.bumblefoot.com and http://www.ronthal.com
enjoooooooy!!


# 17
Joseph
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Joseph
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01/13/2002 11:48 pm
Originally posted by Parrot Head 1970
Not that I'm knocking many of the newer bands, but I can't find a new act whose guitarist gives me something to feed off of.

All the best!!!!!! :cool:


Do what I do, delve into the past. I seriously love the guitar work of Django Reinhardt, I never listened to his stuff much when I was growing up, but he's a wonderful musician. It's amazing what this guy was able to accomplish after such a crippling injury, listen to his stuff and it will definitely add some much needed fluidity to your technique. Also, I can never get enough of Pink Floyd, if you're in need of some inspiration, just listen to THE WALL a couple of times during the week. Trust me you'll be flyting in no time.

Yeah, it bugs me at times that most of the mainstream music doesn't do much to replenish my juices, however, check out some local bands in your area, because jus because they're not ripping up the charts that doesn't mean they're not out there.

-Joseph


www.ragmagazine.com
"Swoop and soar like the blues angels."
# 18
mamamalabass
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mamamalabass
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01/14/2002 12:04 am
My worst fault is that I would like to play like Jaco but I spend so much time on criticising myself for every little mistake that I lose sight of the big picture.
# 19
Parrot Head 1970
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Parrot Head 1970
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01/14/2002 1:35 am
I checked out some Dream Theater this afternoon. You hit the right spot. Also ordered a Django compilation. (hard to find in the local store)

Should keep me guessing for awhile!

All the best!!!!!! :cool:
# 20

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